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Thread: RPGCast - Episode 201: "I Got 99 Problems But LAN Play Ain't One"

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    Man vs. Slime, the fourth type of conflict Administrator sabin1001's Avatar
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    RPGCast - Episode 201: "I Got 99 Problems But LAN Play Ain't One"

    RPGCast - Episode 201: "I Got 99 Problems But LAN Play Ain't One"

    Torchlight II gets delayed and Chris gets counseling to deal with his feelings. We learn more about Japanese culture and what it means to be a LAN gamer today. Finally, the most important lesson we learn is that of Vanguard Bandit's US release date.

    You can find the links to all our stories on delicious: http://delicious.com/rpgamer/201

    RPGCast streams live, sometimes on Friday at 10 PM Eastern / 7 PM Pacific, usually on Saturday at Noon Eastern / 9 AM Pacific.

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    I didn't learn anything! MasterChief's Avatar
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    Wow, Chris, not only do you come across as selfish, but belligerant as well. What the hell does it matter to you what other people want to do? So, Anna and Manny are gonna play LAN Torchlight 2, so what? You wanna know why they should include it? For the same damned reason Call of Duty has System Link and split-screen modes. For the same reason people would rather play a fighting game in an arcade where the other guy's next to them instead of half a world away. Sometimes people wanna have a lag-free game instead of having your connection decide your success, or don't want their experience interrupted by rage-quitters and vulgar bastards. Maybe they'd like to play the game after the inevitable server shutdown. Maybe they're not just complete shut-ins like you. Seriously, telling Anna to "read her Kindle," smacks of "Let them eat cake!" So she wants to play her game online, what the hell's it matter to you?

    And really, telling Runic they should be charging $60? We should be applauding them for having the courage to charge a reasonable price for their game. It's the same selfish, entitled way you rail against people like me who prefer physical media, and it really makes me sick. At least try to look beyond your ivory tower.
    Last edited by Rosestorm; 11-21-2011 at 12:36 AM.

    "What the f--- is a Shakespeare?"
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    Host of The Sectorcast Rosestorm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MasterChief View Post
    It's the same selfish, entitled way you rail against people like me who prefer physical media, and it really makes me sick.
    On consoles phyiscal media isn't going anywhere, but if your a PC gamer like me, downloads are just something you'll have to live with. I love them.

    Quote Originally Posted by MasterChief View Post
    At least try to look beyond your ivory tower.
    But our ivory tower is so pretty its hard not to stare at it, I can build you one in Minecraft if you want.
    Deputy Editor of Gamersector.com
    Check out my podcast Sectorcast, http://gamersector.com/podcast/sectorcast
    A lie would be considered the truth if only more people believed it.

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    Member Retrovertigo's Avatar
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    To be honest I'm finding it harder to listen to the podcast now Mikel isn't a regular. Chris is too pushy with his opinions (and they are opinions, not fact as he would like to think) and Mikel is good at standing up to him and arguing counter points.

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    I didn't learn anything! MasterChief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Retrovertigo View Post
    To be honest I'm finding it harder to listen to the podcast now Mikel isn't a regular. Chris is too pushy with his opinions (and they are opinions, not fact as he would like to think) and Mikel is good at standing up to him and arguing counter points.
    Well, Anna and Manny are at least there to stand up to him. It's not like the Bombcast, which eventually became torture to listen to for me because because they were all united in their selfishness. At least you here you have differing opinions, and the arguing spices things up, though I do agree that Chris needs to stop being such a bleephole when people don't agree with him. Seems Mikel's the only one he really cares to listen to.

    "What the f--- is a Shakespeare?"
    -Rico Valasquez, showing off why no one likes him.

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    In episode 201, the crew asked for possible questions for Random Encounters. Here's one: what have you been thankful for in 2011?

    To answer my own question, my first response would be friends and family. It's embarrassing for me to admit this, but I have finally realized how important they are. I thought games mattered. I thought that music mattered. But do they? Bollocks! Not compared to how people matter.

    And in second place, I'm thankful for having a decent job and a reliable car. I know too many people who can't say that. Far in third place would be board and card games, and other entertainment.

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    How do you kill trolls in Skyrim? FIRE!!! Get a fire enchanted weapon or summon a flame atronach. I've been playing through with archery, sneaking, and conjuration (for the flame atronachs) as my main skills, and the game has gotten a bit easy for me on master difficulty (I'm level 34 and am probably about half way though the game). I'm not used to this happening to me in games, so maybe the archery and sneaking skill trees may be a bit overpowered. Maxing out archery along with lots off points in sneaking makes things die very quickly.

    4.5/5 seems like the right score to me (for the PC version anyway), even if it is one of the best games I've played in the last few years. The UI on the PC controls horribly unless you're using a console controller and they've stuck with a few of the same flawed design decisions that (IMO) made Oblivion inferior to Morrowind. 1-2 years from now, once there are complete overhaul mods for the game as there are for Oblivion, I expect Skyrim to be a 5/5 game.

    Quote Originally Posted by MasterChief View Post
    Wow, Chris, not only do you come across as selfish, but belligerant as well. What the hell does it matter to you what other people want to do? So, Anna and Manny are gonna play LAN Torchlight 2, so what?
    To be fair to Chris, I think he was arguing less about the inclusion of LAN play and more about the idea that LAN (and offline) play is a huge selling point for TL2 over Diablo 3. People are making it out to be a massive difference between the two games when it's probably fairly minor to all but a very select handful of players.

    Quote Originally Posted by Retrovertigo View Post
    To be honest I'm finding it harder to listen to the podcast now Mikel isn't a regular. Chris is too pushy with his opinions (and they are opinions, not fact as he would like to think) and Mikel is good at standing up to him and arguing counter points.
    I like Mikel, but when he's on, he and Chris tend to dominate the podcast a bit too much. Everybody seems to contribute more equally when he's not there.

    Random encounter question. Are full-fledged expansions a complete thing of the past? I'd love to see something along the lines of the Shivering Isles as an expansion to Skyrim, but with the way DLC has developed since Oblivion's time, is there any chance we'll see one? Or are we stuck with smaller bite-sized DLC adventures that are completely independent from each other?
    Last edited by Azilis; 11-24-2011 at 03:32 AM.

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    Member Savorien's Avatar
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    I tend to agree with Chris, but I think his point got lost in the shuffle of rage. Outside of asian countries with populated internet cafes, I don't know who LAN play is for anymore. I literally cannot connect with the idea because my life has been so connected to online since I first had dial up internet over a decade ago. Internet service continues to grow. Even places in rural Manitoba where I used to live they are beginning to get broadband internet. I'm talking about a township population of 300 people (Roland, Manitoba says hi). Currently I live in Vancouver and if i want to pony up the money I can get Unlimited 250 which gives me 250mb/s download, 15mb/s upload, no bandwidth cap. I mean, that's ridiculous. And it's only going to advance further as technology does. I'm really really really getting tired of this 'always connected' phobia. Your fears of lack of comfort have no place here. And as we refuse to leave our Ivory Tower, so to do you refuse to leave your Ramshackled Shacklehut.

    Manny also made some good points. Runic can do what they want to do and don't have to fall under Blizzard's design philosophy, although I'm sure Blizzard has good data on why they aren't including LAN in D3, such as a lack of economic viability for the man hours involved. I think sometimes people like to gloss over the fact that game developers are paid a lot of money. A LOT. It's not 5000 man hours of minimum wage to put in a feature, you understand. My wife who is a software engineer has worked in the game industry for 4-5 years now, and she currently makes more money than my dad who has a senior lead position at his company for over 30 years. So maybe it makes dollars and sense (c wut I did thar?) for Runic to include LAN, and not so much for Blizzard because it's a bigger, more expensively produced game, and lack of LAN won't impede their sales enough for them to worry about it. Who really knows?

    All we can go on is that decisions were made, and you can't please everyone.

    Are we done yet?
    Vanillaware’s 2D is, once again, shaming their competitor’s 3D. It’s like, what are you even doing with your extra D, jerks? Maybe we should hold that extra D in reserve for you, like a trust, until you are ready. - Tycho, Penny Arcade

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    Man vs. Slime, the fourth type of conflict Administrator sabin1001's Avatar
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    Wow, not much I can say in this thread, apparently no one liked that conversation.

    I feel Torchlight 2's LAN play is a nice feature for them to market with, but won't actually factor as much into people's actual use as people seem to say it will.

    I don't believe it's selfish to want to see Runic succeed and make lots of money, since I don't work for them. I honestly believe they could charge more for their game and should put more money into it and keep polishing it more. They have the talent to make a game that could last longer and have a bigger impact than Diablo 3, I'd like them to take all the steps (like upping their budget) that could help them do that.

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    Well, I'm not a big fan of starting the podcast with an all out fight, especially about what seems an utterly inconsequential matter. It was kind of confusing to be honest.

    Quinns, I remember Chip's Challenge - a 2d puzzler with physics (i.e., different tiles did different things :P). I do not recall if it let you skip levels which were too difficult or just start at different level sets. Got it with a disc containing other Win95 games like jazzball.

    Assuming TL2 will come out February-ish, I'm more concerned it might run headlong into Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning. With all the buzz around Skyrim at the moment, and assuming Amalur is any good, people might go for that, instead.

    Random Encounter:
    Western mechanics with Japanese storytelling, or Western storytelling with Japanese mechanics?
    Lately it seems that critique of JRPGs is more about the storytelling and characters, rather than the mechanics. I guess enough time has passed without a significant JRPG with turn-based combat that people are now focusing on the storytelling instead to explain the decline of the genre in the West.
    Also, I'm just going to throw out the name Anachronox into this discussion. Just to see what happens.

  11. #11
    複線ドリフト!! RPGamer Staff Quin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Namos View Post
    Anachronox
    I love you.

    befriend (v.): to use mecha-class beam weaponry to inflict grievous bodily harm on a target in the process of proving the validity of your belief system.

  12. #12
    I didn't learn anything! MasterChief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savorien
    I'm really really really getting tired of this 'always connected' phobia. Your fears of lack of comfort have no place here. And as we refuse to leave our Ivory Tower, so to do you refuse to leave your Ramshackled Shacklehut.
    Well, since you're bringing it up, You're confusing the issue. No one's afraid of the internet, but I don't see why it should be required for everything. There's still a place for local multiplayer, and just because it doesn't fit yours and Chris' lifestyles doesn't mean the rest of us should have it taken away.

    Quote Originally Posted by Azillis
    To be fair to Chris, I think he was arguing less about the inclusion of LAN play and more about the idea that LAN (and offline) play is a huge selling point for TL2 over Diablo 3. People are making it out to be a massive difference between the two games when it's probably fairly minor to all but a very select handful of players.
    Which was never the point that Anna and Manny were trying to make. While being able to play the game solo without the fear of a connection hiccup forcing you to restart a dungeon certainly has its appeal, Chris (and many of the others for whom the internet is the center of their lives) act as though because an always-on requirement works for him, it should be fine for everyone. Sorry, it's not, and Chris isn't going to make it so no matter how much he shouts down everyone who doesn't agree with him.

    "What the f--- is a Shakespeare?"
    -Rico Valasquez, showing off why no one likes him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Namos View Post
    Also, I'm just going to throw out the name Anachronox into this discussion. Just to see what happens.
    Still one of my all time favorites. It's too easy, but that hardly matters when everything else about it is so good.

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