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Thread: RPGamer's Battle System Battle Royale - General Discussion

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    Ysy St. Administrator Macstorm's Avatar
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    RPGamer's Battle System Battle Royale - General Discussion

    Greetings again.

    The Battle System Battle Royale will be starting soon, but before it does I wanted to detail exactly how things are going to work. I took nominations from staff and readers alike and have tallied them up into a Top 32 list. I've finished seeding the tournament and when it starts, we all get to take part. For each match, two games will be pitted against each other with us comparing their battle systems only. During these matches an even number of staff members (4 early on, more in later matches) will vote on which game has the better battle system and why. At the same time, we will be running a poll on the front page of the site with the same two games up and the winner will count as the readers' vote. This way there will be five votes for each pairing with the winner moving on.

    Update: The Bracket and Match Schedule for Round One are live. http://www.rpgamer.com/news/Q2-2014/041714a.html
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    Certified Polygameist RPGamer Staff jcservant's Avatar
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    Let's DOOOOO this!!!

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    Member Rockko's Avatar
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    This should be fun.

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    Classic Console Junkie redwing42's Avatar
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    I didn't get around to submitting a pre-ranking list, but I think this will be an interesting exercise.

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    Ysy St. Administrator Macstorm's Avatar
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    Round 1 is going to be starting soon, but before it does here are our Top 32 in unranked order. They have since been seeded, and that will be revealed when we start.

    Top 32
    Baldur's Gate II
    Bravely Default
    Breath of Fire: Dragon Quarter
    Chrono Trigger
    Dark Souls
    Diablo II
    Disgaea 4: A Promise Unforgotten
    Fallout 3
    Final Fantasy Tactics
    Final Fantasy VI
    Final Fantasy X
    Final Fantasy X-2
    Final Fantasy XII
    Final Fantasy XIII
    Fire Emblem: Awakening
    Grandia II
    Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning
    Persona 4 Golden
    Pokemon X/Y
    Radiant Historia
    Resonance of Fate
    Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor
    Shining Force III
    Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together
    Tales of Graces f
    The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time
    The World Ends With You
    Valkyria Chronicles
    Valkyrie Profile
    Xenoblade Chronicles
    Xenogears
    Ys Seven

    Staff Battlers
    7thCircle (Glenn)
    StrawBerryEggs (Cassandra)
    CofLSilk (Ken)
    JC Servant (Phil)
    JMustang1968 (Johnathan)
    JuMeSyn (Mike M)
    Keldarus (Paul)
    Macstorm (Mac)
    Nyx (Sam)
    Ocelot (Becky)
    Robomega (Adriaan)
    severinmira (Alex)
    InstaTrent (Trent)
    TwinBahamut (Nathan)
    Wheels (Mike A)
    "The universe is already mad. Anything else would be redundant."
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    Member Zeboyd Games's Avatar
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    Disappointed that some of these entries are obviously based on the game's overall quality & popularity and not the battle system itself. Specifically Final Fantasy 6 (generic ATB battle system), Ocarina of Time (groundbreaking but literally every 3D Zelda game released after it has better combat), Grandia 2 (though 2 is the better game overall, 3's saving grace is the better battle system) and Ys 7 (Ys: Memories of Celceta has the same battle system but with some fixes & better balance).
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    Ysy St. Administrator Macstorm's Avatar
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    Very true, which was to be expected. This is why for the tourney itself we'll be holding staff to the fire to explain WHY they are picking the game they want to move on. And also why we are not just using the poll for the tournament like GameFAQs does.
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    BEARSONA RPGamer Staff Paws's Avatar
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    I like the fact we have so many Mikes they need initials and nicknames.

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    RPGamer Staff RPGamer Staff Wheels's Avatar
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    It's a regular old Michael Royal

  10. #10
    That might be one of the worst lists I've ever seen. 6 Final Fantasies and not a single Dragon Quest? Fallout 3 over an Elder Scrolls game? *yawn*

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    is not declawed RPGamer Staff Ocelot's Avatar
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    I do think in most cases it's a matter of exposure. In my case (Grandia 2 over 3), I simply never played 3, so I nominated 2. I did nominate Memories of Celceta, but again, it hasn't been out for long, so a lot of people probably haven't gotten to it yet.

    In terms of FF VI, which I've also never played (and yes, the staff regularly rakes me over the coals for it), we needed a representative of the baseline ATB battle system. I'm not super-fond of ATB, but I know a lot of people are, and in my mind one baseline ATB game is as good as another for that purpose.

    As for Zelda, I have no idea. I personally nominated Skyward Sword (I generally tried to keep my noms to one per series) because I loved its motion control battle system and I don't care what some people say.

    Looking forward to arguing with y'all! C'mon Mac, put me up against the sacred cows of RTWP and ATB, you know you want to. ::evil grin:: (Edit: Oh, wait, I just saw the seeds and you diiiid.)
    Last edited by Ocelot; 04-15-2014 at 02:44 PM. Reason: I checked my e-mail.

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    Ysy St. Administrator Macstorm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smacd View Post
    That might be one of the worst lists I've ever seen. 6 Final Fantasies and not a single Dragon Quest? Fallout 3 over an Elder Scrolls game? *yawn*
    I'm with you on no DQ. I had three on my nomination list (Joker 2, IX, and Rocket Slime), but alas! But yeah, I'll take Fallout 3 over any ES game as far as battle systems go, but neither series would actually be on my list.
    "The universe is already mad. Anything else would be redundant."
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  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Macstorm View Post
    I'm with you on no DQ. I had three on my nomination list (Joker 2, IX, and Rocket Slime), but alas! But yeah, I'll take Fallout 3 over any ES game as far as battle systems go, but neither series would actually be on my list.
    Those three DQs are definitely good ones.

    I guess on going back over the list, there are a couple good games on the list. Dark Souls felt really organic. Xenoblade wasn't bad. I like a few aspects of a few other games, but most of them fail as a whole. Granted, my favorite battle systems include "mindlessly press A until its over because battles generally get in the way of the story". The battle systems have to be really engrossing to get me interested. All the needlessly complex ones that aren't fun, might as well not have bothered. There are a few on that list that I think tried some interesting things but really failed as a whole. Still, 6 Final Fantasies....

  14. #14
    is not declawed RPGamer Staff Ocelot's Avatar
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    RPGamer began its history as a Square Enix fan site. Many of its staffers have long and deep histories as fans of Final Fantasy in particular, and same with many of the long-time readers. I'm one of the few who doesn't, in fact, so this isn't a defensive post as much as an explanation. Like it or not, FF is going to be a big part of anything the site does.

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    Ysy St. Administrator Macstorm's Avatar
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    Indeed. And in many cases, FFs are all different. Unlike something like Demon's Souls vs. Dark Souls or DQIV vs. DQV where it's more or less the same system.
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    Staff Girly Girl RPGamer Staff Nyx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ocelot View Post
    RPGamer began its history as a Square Enix fan site. Many of its staffers have long and deep histories as fans of Final Fantasy in particular, and same with many of the long-time readers. I'm one of the few who doesn't, in fact, so this isn't a defensive post as much as an explanation. Like it or not, FF is going to be a big part of anything the site does.
    I am in the same boat as you, but I admit to generally disliking FF on a whole (unless you say, Tactics or FF6) the series has done nothing to entice me over the years. But I understand people's deep love for the series, I'm just the crank who doesn't see the glory.

    Yay for crankiness and battle systems! Also, I like DQ and it's battle systems. I totes forgot about Rocket Slime which I completed adored. I make sad faces now.

  17. #17
    Overdosing Heavenly Bliss Moderator ChickenGod's Avatar
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    Yeah, I agree with Zeboyd on all counts except Ys 7. Seven has better bosses, dungeon crawling, and music in my opinion, but I definitely think Celceta has the superior character selection and skills. Either one would have worked well, just like Persona 3 or Persona 4.

    I'm also a little disappointed to see Resonance of Fate and Shining Force 3 on there. Shining Force 3, while a fun and charming game, certainly doesn't have the depth that a Wild Arms XF or other tactical games such as Super Robot Taisen do. Resonance of Fate's battle system was needlessly complex and ultimately boiled down to using a few simple patterns over and over again (scratch off armor then shoot) and one character was almost always delegated as a meat shield. Theres more to it than just that of course, but the battles are probably some of my least favorite in RPG history, right up there with Xenosaga 2, so I'm extremely biased against it.

    Pokemon X and Y is a curious case as well. Personally I feel that if it is taken as purely a single player experience, then there isn't much challenge to be had and the true art of the battle system becomes lost against a very poor AI that does not ask much of the player. The multiplayer aspect however is where you can see tons of various strategies and mind games to be had against real human opponents. I'm curious to see how the staff judges this one, for sure.
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    Member Zeboyd Games's Avatar
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    Yeah, Shining Force 3 is an odd choice compared to all the other SRPGs that could have been mentioned instead.

    And I'm glad to hear that I'm not the only one who thought that Resonance of Fate was a huge mess, though I can see why some people like it. It's very difficult just to figure out what on earth the battle system wants you to do, but once you figure it out, it becomes boring & tedious since you don't really need to mix up your strategy much over the course of the entire game.
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  19. #19
    Oh, Resonance of Fate is a weird animal all right, but as far as battle systems go, it's more unique than many of the systems on that list. Hate it all you want, but there is nothing quite like it, and there is always the possibility someone can do it better. Good idea, bad execution so to speak, so it's worth giving the battle system praise.

    You know, a PROGRESSION based contest might have been more interesting. RoF wasn't so hot, but finding ways to slap a ridiculous number of parts onto the guns was great fun. I'd LOVE to see more of that in other games. Heck, Borderlands would do well with that sort of thing. It's amazing how much little bits and parts you may not even notice affect the gun's final stats.
    Last edited by TG Barighm; 04-15-2014 at 04:04 PM.

  20. #20
    BEARSONA RPGamer Staff Paws's Avatar
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    I actually like the fact that some of these choices seem "wrong" (airquote wrong) -- the battle will be more interesting when people need to really back up their choice with good prose.

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